53 and journal of change

53nomorepmo

Active Member
I am not sure where to begin, but I suppose a summary of the issue.  I have used PMO on and off since around 1999 after my first wife died from cancer - and some before that time, but I don't think it was an issue (not frequent).  I have a story with regard to porn that is very similar to all this age group.  I found my first porn around the age of 12 or so.  Back then Playboy was in the barber shop and pretty much everywhere.  Then I found my dad's stash of more hardcore material Hustler, and some sort of medical hardcore sex magazine - you know porn pretending to be educational.  I fapped to that for 4 years without being found out.  Loved it.  However, it was not really out of control.  During my first marriage my wife was very much opposed to porn, but that didn't stop me from time to time sneaking away to beat it.  I purchased the hardest magazine available, but it would be considered soft porn these days.  I would say at that point it was intermittent and not a problem.  My sex life with my first wife of 16 years, who I loved very much, was unadventurous, but regular, and I didn't really need much else.  We did have issues, but that was long time ago. 

I quickly remarried a women who was the most sexual person I have ever met, but she was also reckless and a sociopath.  However, the sex especially the first year was something I had never experience in my life.  We did everything including swapping partners (once).  We filmed sex, "cammed" with couples on the Internet, and watched lots of porn during sex.  I quickly became a porn addict, but also a sex addict.  I got to tell you it was fantastic even if I knew logically I was going to pay a price for all the endorphin release.  I had two wonderful girls (one with developmental issues) and divorced after this women became a full blown drug addict and alcoholic.  So the price I paid for this adventure was extraordinarily high.  In a way I was glad I had the sexual adventure of a life time.  I don't regret that part at all.

Flash ahead a few years to my current relationship now in it's 7th year.  I married a women who again had alcohol issues.  This effected our sex life, and thanks to my previous experience with PMO and extreme sexual adventure I began to PMO as a substitute for real sex.  Wife 3 now has her issues mostly under control, but I found that I had substituted my imaginary sex life to a rather extreme degree.  I looked at porn everyday at work (I have my own business) before settling down to my job.  I edged for 2 or 3 hours a day at times.  Taking breaks (days off).  Unlike many here until recently I was able to get it up for my wife when she wanted it, but I wasn't pursuing her.  When we had sex I was often thinking about a porn flick.  I was also so frequent in my PMO that I managed to embarrass myself at least 3 different times by getting caught.  The last time by my 23 year old step daughter.  The first time by my wife (who masturbates as well and was actually pretty good about it, other than following up on it to frequently with questions).  Also I was overheard by a business associate and my business partner at least once each.  I am in a very conservative line of work so this was not good.  Like many here ED was beginning to be an issue, and I had trouble responding when my wife was pulling me into the bedroom.  Basically it has become a full blown problem I wish to do without.

To be perfectly clear I have very little if any guilt about PMO.  I actually think if it were not for the social issues, ED, and potential trade off for real sex I might no be concerned.  However, it is a problem when you find yourself compulsively looking for a bigger and different fix.  Even though I was straight I found myself drawn more into bisexual porn, and more extreme porn just to get a kick.  I found myself on craigslist and even posted an ad thinking I might like to try every possible sex act I hadn't yet participated in, and some of it counter to my actual sexual preference.  It occurred to me after a few months of this I was simply trying to get a fix.  To continue the novelty of something new and I was risking my entire life to do it.  I never acted on the real life compulsion, but felt that if I didn't stop I might well find myself doing something I would regret.  So here I am.

I have not PMO'd in 10 days, and I already feel better.  I am hoping this journal will provide me with the support I need to get my sex life back to what I expect it to be.  My marriage isn't strong now, and I am not sure it will last, but this is actually about me.  I am hoping that feeling better about myself and getting back in touch with my real sexual being will help my marriage (may not). 

My wife's use of Zoloft and Xanax in addition to her alcohol use (more occasional now) has made sex a once a week or less event.  As my sex drive is high, although misdirected IMO, my goal may be just to get to a point where occasional but healthy MO is needed.  First I need to reboot, and I am guessing for me that may mean 90 days... No PMO, and very little if any MO.  I will need all the help I can get.  I talked to my wife about this generally and hope she can help. 
 

Phase2

Well-Known Member
Welcome. You story is so familiar. Just change a few things and situations and it pretty much lines up with a heck of a lot of us. You are in the right place and doing the right thing. Once you come out on the other side of your reboot, you may find what you thought was normal or necessary just isn't anymore. It's good that you know that you are doing this for YOU. Keep going. You are well on your way.

I used yourbrainonporn.com a lot for info. Keep educating yourself. Watch the vids and listen to the radio shows. Good luck!
 

53nomorepmo

Active Member
Thank you Phase2, I am very anxious at this stage of my recovery.  One thing that keeps cycling through my mind is a fear that I will be perpetually in need of sex without an outlet after my reboot.  I would be very interested in advice from others who might be in a situation similar to mine.  That is, a wife, or partner that is not available as often as they would like.  I know PMO is not an option, it seems to warp my outlook on sex as well as interfere with the opportunities I have for real intimacy.  However, my issue appears to be a libido that will be running a lot higher than my wife's once this is done.

I am using this site and others like it to educate myself, and actually have done a lot of reading before getting to the point of wanting to act on reversing this issue in my life.  So far so good...  I did touch myself last night, but was able to back off before going MO.  The temptation to jump into old habits is strong and I realize I am going to have to make this a conscious and ongoing effort.  11 days without PMO and 2 without MO.  I have had sex once without an O which I am reading is likely because I have flat lined.  I did one MO the next morning I think to prove to myself my penis still worked.  However, my O was weak, which really caught me by surprise since at that time it had been 9 days without an O. 

PMO really fired up my sex drive, but left me flat with regard to being spontaneous and engaged in an intimate way with my spouse.  I was having the PIED for sure, but worse I got to a place where I was thinking about my latest porn fetish when having sex instead of my partner... not good!
 

sodonewithit

Active Member
Your story isn't very odd or different compared to the rest of us here which is both kinda funny and not at the same time. 

I can answer somewhat to the question of if your drive is higher than the woman and it basically is more seduction should lead to better and more frequent sex.  MO might find a home in a few months but it might not.  At this stage just attempt to have no MO of any kind for the next month or three.  It's a hard first few weeks but after the time flies to some degree. 

I somewhat felt the same that the porn and such wasn't really a issue but that might change also, when you are under the spell it's gotcha.  The progressive nature is what lead me to believe it is just plan bad and that even with her touch I was having major problems with ED but 70+ days in and its all changed.

Anyways good to see you here and I look forward to seeing the next installment!
 

53nomorepmo

Active Member
Thank you sodonewithit, and especially thank you for the expression of my story as "isn't very odd or different" I can tell you as I was writing it I certainly was hesitant to let it all out.  After all I had been burying this thing, even from myself, for a long time.  I, like many here, justified my behavior based on not getting enough, and needing to balance out my sex drive with my spouse.  My wife was having her own issues at the time, and still has many issues due to her own demons - substance issues, and past sexual abuse.  My use of PMO was at first a very satisfying way of just taking care of the issue of not getting what I needed.

Not that I wasn't headed towards trouble even before I met her, it was just more "in check."  I realized that I wasn't really bi or bi-curious just looking for something novel.  The thrill of imagining real life encounters on Craigslist that would never happen to get a thrill became boring, and the realization that I wouldn't really want anyone I talked to on email anyway.  I realized that if the full extent of my actions ever came out I would quickly ruin my life, career, and relationships over something that was fake!

I am trying real hard not to MO during this reboot.  Sodonewithit your advice seems right on the money.  Last night I thought about MO, and got hard while shopping on Amazon of all things!  Not that shopping was turning me on, it was thinking about what I would have been doing and reaching down to give myself a little rub... then stopped it before I went very far with it, but the temptation of reverting is very strong right now.

I am sincerely hoping that reconnecting with my wife in a more emotional and real way will get me to a place where our needs are closer to being aligned, but not counting on it... One thing I know for sure PMO will mess me up.  Passing on real sex or not performing because you wore yourself out on a computer earlier that day doesn't work.  Risking your career and personal relationships in pursuit of novel pixels... well geez that is logically a no brainer.  And the fix I was needing was becoming more and more out of step with the real me - I came to this conclusion after hearing this Ted Talk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wSF82AwSDiU  This turned on the light bulb over my head...  Still it took me over a year of reading on the subject to come to the conclusion that 1) This is real and 2) This is my problem as well.

BTW you may be aware there is debate among academics whether or not this PMO need is an addiction.  I would like to put forth that it absolutely makes no difference whether PMO is an addiction or not.  What is absolutely true about it, and universally consistent is PMO may rewire us in such a way that it is difficult to function in a normal sexual manner with our significant others.  That the rewire is the most harmful for young people or the sexually inexperienced.  This group and forum are doing important work by getting the real story of the issue out in a way it can be evaluated and the real issue exposed.
 

sodonewithit

Active Member
Three times I've written a reply and twice I made a mistake and deleted it....

Justification is a odd beast and we can  twist it to meet any situation.  I, sadly, can recall fapping out of my perceived lack of sex but now the times are drastically higher, not teenagers level but we are middle-aged so I'm pleased.

The craigs list stuff reminds me of a posting I read on ybop where a much younger guy found himself urm submitting but it was a porn induced fantasy.  Made me worry for the crazy thoughts which had passed in my skull.  I don't think there is anything wrong with two guys, everythings great about two chicks
 
B

Brodie

Guest
Keep up the process 53nomorepmo. I think that is the key. If  you continue to journal and connect with guy in a similar situation, it will help the process of recovery. I also agree the discussion regarding P as a true addition is crap. It really doesn't matter if it is screwing up your life. I know it was screwing up mine.

Keep talking and keep working on the process. We all can do this if we work together!
 

sodonewithit

Active Member
Hrmm, my lengthy reply seems to have been cut off.  Must be a mobile issue...there was lots of great blah blah in that post above.
 

Phase2

Well-Known Member
Two things:

You mention you are worried about not being satisfied by your wife after you reboot because of your very high sex drive. I think once you have rebooted and gotten away from porn for a few/several months, you will find your relationship to sex and your 'drive' will be quite different. When you watch porn, it gets in your head and overstimulates you. You end up thinking about it and striving to get it all the time. Once you are free of porn, this changes. Your concern about your wife may not be nearly as big an issue then as you perceive it to be now.

And Gary Wilson is quite clear that after your reboot, masturbation is a perfectly acceptable option as long as you are not fantasizing about porn stars or porn scenes you've enjoyed in your past. Focus on the physical sensation of masturbation and get off that way if you really need a release. Just stay the course and avoid pixels.
 

53nomorepmo

Active Member
Thank you all, got to say I had very good wood last night.  Tried to get the wife interested... she wasn't.  I did M not with P and tried to visualize without bringing in anyone other than my wife.  Seemed to be a healthy thing.  Phase2, I think you may well be correct.  Things already do seem to be getting better, and to be honest I am not cut off from sex, it just isn't as frequent as I would like... PMO is not an option just hoping it can stay that way and plan to give it 100%. 

Brodie thanks for the comment on addiction... could be or not be crap.  I personally think it may well be just a way to describe what is happening with regard to rewiring and addiction is a handy word to describe it, the description is completely irrelevant; it sounds like you may agree as the bottom line is - PMO screws up real world sex and relationships.  Once my 90 days are over I hope to make this a life long pledge, and strike a healthy balance in all areas of my life.  I feel better already.
 

53nomorepmo

Active Member
sodonewithit said:
Three times I've written a reply and twice I made a mistake and deleted it....

Justification is a odd beast and we can  twist it to meet any situation.  I, sadly, can recall fapping out of my perceived lack of sex but now the times are drastically higher, not teenagers level but we are middle-aged so I'm pleased.

The craigs list stuff reminds me of a posting I read on ybop where a much younger guy found himself urm submitting but it was a porn induced fantasy.  Made me worry for the crazy thoughts which had passed in my skull.  I don't think there is anything wrong with two guys, everythings great about two chicks

Sorry to hear that part of this post may have been cut off.. I find your comments valuable!  The Craiglist surfing for me was very much a temptation to make porn fantasies real, the odd thing for me was that I was headed off in directions for which I had no real sexual interest... Actually had to wrap my mind around the fact I was doing this for the novelty of it.  Once that sunk in I quit... but it was one of the wake up calls that lead me here.  Why was I doing that?  I am actually very open minded about sex as it pertains to others... guys, girls, groups, whatever.. but my actions were running counter to my best interest, my real orientation, and the risk and potential damage should I be found out... WTF was I doing?  Anyway on the mend now and feeling much better.
 

sodonewithit

Active Member
Glad to hear its going in the correct direction. 

I had wanted ti comment about the addictive side of the conversation.  I read similar articles and also ones questioning if pmo might be related to pied both of which I believe are possible, certainly for myself anyways.  It's hard to think that a rational guy would turn down direct free sex to jerk instead, goes against tbe programming which evolution has given us.  For myself I certainly did, maybe not in foresight but certainly in hindsight.  My own pied or ed has been cleared up tona nice degree and I think this is directly from both no porn but also no MO.  The reset of the the nerves and no deathgrip has helped alot I think.

As the sentence which go cut off was talking about various couples I wanted to finish that thought.  I'm all for everyone havi g a partner and it's not for me to impose any thoughts, frankly I don't care.  No one wants to watch me and I don't want to watch you so good enough. Where I was going was about the young man who found himself with another guy but it wawasn't his cup of tea.  The addiction and progression lead him to this and that says all I need to know that this stuff is bad, how could it not be.

This is all for now.
 

53nomorepmo

Active Member
Sodonewithit, thanks for time finishing that thought.  The wife was in the mood last night.  We were both sober and I was able to perform, although not as well as I would have liked.  There may have been factors at work.  Lack of sleep etc... I am in a minor "flatline" period for sure.  I think part of what was going on with me was trying to concentrate on love making with my wife and avoid my old habits of bringing in mental images I stored thanks to years of PMO.  Mostly successful at doing this, but not 100% successful.  Some of my favorite scenes or fetishes popped up.  I will try again.  I think I am definitely on the mend since I am doing a better job of talking and showing interest to my wife, and I can tell you that she is responding positively to the change.  Just need to stay on track.  I am hoping that since I really do have a history (long ago) of "normal" and "loving" sex I can get back to that in time.  Damn PMO!  Funny how something that felt so good for so long ended up messing with my head like this.  Glad I identified the issue. 

BTW, I think there are other factors at play here as well.  I am 53 and I can feel some changes in my abilities that are more related to age then PMO... However, with PMO in the mix I won't know how much of the issue is PMO and how much the other for at least my reboot period.  I suspect I will M from time to time, and likely depending on how much actual sex I get during my reboot as well.  However, I gave a personal goal of keeping this to a minimum and only when needed in order to make this reboot take.  Thanks everyone for the comments and support I really appreciate it.
 

sodonewithit

Active Member
I've found that the longer this goes the less I can remember the stuff on the screen.  The more novel videos which caught my attention stick around but the general crap is done.

I'm a good few years younger than you so indeed other factors could be at play and it is hard to debate what degree tbose might be.  For my own thoughts i am just stayi g away from it and letting her take the frustrations
 

53nomorepmo

Active Member
Well the wife just decided to get drunk and not pick up my daughter from a school event.  Had to leave work... in the past this has been a trigger.  Not going to let this happen this time around.  Seems like even if things can't be worked out I need to stick with no PMO.  Should help me hold my head up.  Geezzzz....  Triggers seem to be #1 Bordom #2 Distraction from life problems (like the above).  I noticed if I was alone at work and doing something frustrating or boring then invariably...

On a different topic I also noted that if I had a really long PMO session I would later be a real grouch to my kids, and irritable about everything.  I am guessing this is sort of the come down after hours of endorphin release... or maybe it was just feeling down on myself or both.  Not sure.  I am guessing everyone experiences this a little differently.
 

unchained

Active Member
I feel that the PMO addiction made me distant and irritable.  It was one of those addiction signs that I never noticed or attributed to porn.  It's funny because I would notice myself acting in ways that didn't fit who I was.  I'm usually the guy in the center of the action, telling jokes & funny stories and having a good time.  Over the last few years I've noticed myself sometimes being short with employees and family.  Most times I would rather be alone than around family & friends.  I also noticed that hobbies and other interests that I was truly passionate about were basically not interesting.  The more I learn about the brain changes due to addiction, the more clearly I see that these changes are the result of my PMO addiction.  I never would have noticed if it weren't for the occasional nonfunctioning dick.  In the end, thank God for the PIED, because all the other stuff heals, too.
 

53nomorepmo

Active Member
unchained said:
I feel that the PMO addiction made me distant and irritable.  It was one of those addiction signs that I never noticed or attributed to porn.  It's funny because I would notice myself acting in ways that didn't fit who I was.  I'm usually the guy in the center of the action, telling jokes & funny stories and having a good time.  Over the last few years I've noticed myself sometimes being short with employees and family.  Most times I would rather be alone than around family & friends.  I also noticed that hobbies and other interests that I was truly passionate about were basically not interesting.  The more I learn about the brain changes due to addiction, the more clearly I see that these changes are the result of my PMO addiction.  I never would have noticed if it weren't for the occasional nonfunctioning dick.  In the end, thank God for the PIED, because all the other stuff heals, too.
I am definitely moody as heck after a long PMO session, but as you can tell from my post concerning my wife's issues I have other things affecting my mood.  Sorting out how much of this was from PMO was very difficult. 

Last night my wife for the first time in months woke me up to give me a BJ.  Felt great, and things are starting to feel normal.  I got off and was able to stay focused on the mission at hand.  I used PMO to avoid sex since I was dealing with a very out of control issue with the wife.  Not that I didn't have issues avoiding it before, but I think this is how it got to the point of replacing actual intimacy. 

Now the issue I face is if I have to give up on this marriage to avoid another large alcohol issue how do I handle not having a partner for sex?  I know PMO isn't an option.  Maybe some limited M until life becomes normal.  Maybe it won't balloon into a divorce issue again, but right now it looks bleak.  Got to stay strong!  I know if things don't work out I will likely never have a relationship again if I let the PMO back into my life.  I need to avoid reacting to my triggers of stress and boredom and stay in control. 
 

Jimmy James

Active Member
Remember that even if this relationship fails, PMO would just make the next one all that more difficult.  Continue what you are doing as it will only make you better.
 

53nomorepmo

Active Member
No temptation to relapse yet, although I have also "gotten lucky" more frequently then normal.  So that helps.  Seem to be on the right track.  Trying to stay conscious of triggers.  Stress, boredom, and remember old habits... For example I used to start each work day by logging into my favorite porn site and check to see if there was new content. 

I did daily porn site review to avoid work which after 30+ years is not as exciting to me as it used to be.  I am lucky to have my business, and know it, but I am dealing with burnout to a large degree right now. 

The consequence of this habit - what I thought might be 5 or 10 minutes of looking turned later into a full blown PMO session, and sometimes 3 or 4 hours of edging, browsing and finally M.  I have substituted this forum for now, and reading about this issue.  It really seems to help, but at some point I think it might be best to put it all in the background.  I am not there yet, but hope to get to the point where I don't need to even visit the PMO issue except to know it isn't for me anymore.  That is the goal anyway.
 

53nomorepmo

Active Member
No temptation today. 

I have a drawer full of old porn DVD and a VHS tape that I need to throw away.  These actually belong to both my wife and myself so in all rights I need to ask her, but I am sure she won't have a problem with getting rid of our porn; as she expressed about one year ago a desire not to watch anymore porn, and I think she pretty much (although) not completely stays away from porn.  Although she has confessed to looking online a time or two. 

I don't really dig into or use this collection, but it is time for it to go, and I would like to involve my wife in this decision so she can see I am serious about this change.  Trying to figure out the right wording... "Darling, I don't want or need these anymore and am thinking of throwing all this way, are you ok with that?"  - "If not could you please keep this stuff because I don't want it around me anymore."  I am fairly certain I will get a positive response and a she will want it to be thrown out.
 
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