Author Topic: gragnoks journal  (Read 363 times)

gragnok

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gragnoks journal
« on: November 12, 2019, 11:38:38 AM »
11/12/2019 10:32 am
day 0
okay just reset after a 12 day streak. i really feel like i almost made it through. just had the house to myself for the fist time in a long time and caved.
im 27 years old. this year i have been repeatedly trying to quit porn with similar results. 10-12 day streaks and then a relapse.
i am hoping this journal will help me get over the hump. i have quit for long periods in the past and know it is a great improvement in my quality of life/mental health.
i also have been getting sober from alcohol this year, I'm 10 months 15 days sober. i feel that porn has become more inexcusable with the clarity of sobriety from alcohol. and think that porn is the first/oldest problematic compulsion.
sorry kinda of all over the place, but not exactly sure how to do this.

quitforeverthenwin2

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Re: gragnoks journal
« Reply #1 on: November 12, 2019, 12:26:09 PM »
Hey man, welcome to the forum! We've all been there, joining the forum or coming back to it after a lapse. I know exactly what you mean I was in that same, short streak spot over and over. The 10-14 day kind of deal seems to be common and having a journal DEFINITELY helps with that.

Do whatever works for you, there is no real right way to journal. Just tracking what is going on, giving and getting support can make things a lot easier. Big congrats on getting sober from Alcohol, that is a huge accomplishment, just keep that up and get rid of the PMO as well.

One helpful thing is to think about all the great stuff you are going to replace these old addictive behaviors with. It's not just about removing the bad, it's also about thinking about the good stuff. Me and some others have found that, can be really helpful. Focusing on what you want and on positive behaviors rather then just avoiding the negative. It's great you already have experience with this, removing alcohol so what worked there will likely help you with this too.

I also recommend aim to just keep coming back to the forum and posting in the journal, even if you don't feel like it or things are not going as you want. It'll really add up over time.

gragnok

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Re: gragnoks journal
« Reply #2 on: November 12, 2019, 12:51:38 PM »
thanks for responding!
and yeah there does seem to be a lot of similarities to quitting alcohol.
and i like the thinking about all the positive stuff id rather be doing.
exercise is a big one. working out. i am pretty good about doing my cardio but i would love to try to build some muscle and get into strength training. this maybe leans into a bigger issue/what i most want out of quitting porn. i on and off do calisthenics at home (ab stuff, push ups, pull-ups) but at the gym (started going in february) I'm only comfortable on the cardio machines. I'm too intimidated/socially anxious to even walk into the weight room.
point is mostly that i am a pretty socially anxious person and I'm hoping above all that quitting porn will help with addressing this.
there's tons of other stuff, just little things. keeping my apartment nice/super clean, actually cooking healthily food for myself on a regular basis, basically just eating well in general.
i already meditate everyday and journal, habits i picked up quitting alcohol, obviously i will continue to do those.
i also have recently consider a 12 step group or maybe therapy, anyone have any experience with either of those?
probably would enter an alcohol related group if i did 12 step. just a little extra support, and i think i would benefit from helping others. (i basically got sober from alcohol on my own).
anyways really it feels like a continuation of sobriety to me, taking control over more of my life.
anyways looking forward to the journey!

gragnok

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Re: gragnoks journal
« Reply #3 on: November 13, 2019, 02:15:29 PM »
Day one!
Feeling good. Got good sleep, woke up early. Skateboarded all morning even in the freezing temperatures. At Starbucks now not super in a rush to go home before work at 3. But going to soon to walk the dog and stuff. Skating is def my favorite exercise so that’s one of my goals: skate as much as possible. Not sure what else.
Work tonight, and should be pretty easy after that.

quitforeverthenwin2

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Re: gragnoks journal
« Reply #4 on: November 13, 2019, 04:33:51 PM »
Happy to respond! Congrats on day 3! Awesome you have a dog to walk, dogs are the best.

thanks for responding!
and yeah there does seem to be a lot of similarities to quitting alcohol.
and i like the thinking about all the positive stuff id rather be doing.
exercise is a big one. working out. i am pretty good about doing my cardio but i would love to try to build some muscle and get into strength training. this maybe leans into a bigger issue/what i most want out of quitting porn. i on and off do calisthenics at home (ab stuff, push ups, pull-ups) but at the gym (started going in february) I'm only comfortable on the cardio machines. I'm too intimidated/socially anxious to even walk into the weight room.
point is mostly that i am a pretty socially anxious person and I'm hoping above all that quitting porn will help with addressing this.
there's tons of other stuff, just little things. keeping my apartment nice/super clean, actually cooking healthily food for myself on a regular basis, basically just eating well in general.
i already meditate everyday and journal, habits i picked up quitting alcohol, obviously i will continue to do those.
i also have recently consider a 12 step group or maybe therapy, anyone have any experience with either of those?
probably would enter an alcohol related group if i did 12 step. just a little extra support, and i think i would benefit from helping others. (i basically got sober from alcohol on my own).
anyways really it feels like a continuation of sobriety to me, taking control over more of my life.
anyways looking forward to the journey!

Great stuff! I feel you on the anxiety. I think the porn addiction ads to it.
As far as 12 step, my personal recommendation is to stay away. I strongly recommend this especially, since you are having such great success on your own. I agree, helping others, supporting and being supported is AWESOME. The 12 step has that right but.... I went to 12 step for that reason, not taking the steps seriously. But being there for months and months, hearing over and over "you are powerless, you can't control this etc." Eventually did seep into my head and led to me relapsing super bad ( I, like you had a great clean streak going in). I left the group and it took me literally years to regain control of myself and confidence. Worst decision I ever made, was joining 12 step, set me wayyy back in many areas, from all the awful ideas and advice I got. ( The cornerstone of the program is you are powerless, it was like negative affirmations for me and really did lower my self control). They also told me you can't date until god says your ready. So I didn't date or interact with girls for like a year while relapsing all the time and trying to do the 12 steps. It was HORRIBLE. Very hard to regain a good clean streak after that ( YEARS- not until I came to this forum did I pass 30 days again. When I'd been over 100 clean when I entered 12 step- STUPID ME.) And I totally lost my confidence and skills with girls, which really hurt. Dating and rewiring had made the recovery so much easier. I still haven't had a girlfriend since then, and it took years for me to be able to rebuild my skills and get dates again......)  They also have this thing like the sponsors have no ego and are just gods tool. But, god or no god, good people or not. Everyone has an ego, sponsors were competitive with each other and stuff lol.

12 Step has awesome PR, since it basically brainwashes you into thinking it's the only thing that works, so the people who it does work for make it sound awesome. But the dirty secret is the actually success rate of the program is one of the lowest out there. They aren't bad people, there are some great ideas in the program and they all genuinely want to help, but it is very very unhelpful for a lot of people, particularly if you have had success elsewhere, as they will convince you all your success on your own is false.

I strongly recommend SMART recovery, it's a SCIENCE based recovery program/ group. They have an awesome booklet for like $10. They are the second largest nonprofit recovery group in the US and I find their stuff incredibly helpful, they also have online and in person meetings. (Sunday online meeting for sexually maladaptive behaviours is good). Smart basically has a 4 point plan. 1) Build motivation 2) Dealing with urges 3) Challenging/ changing negative thought patterns 4) Finding activities you love etc. to replace the old addictive behavior. They have no position on other recovery programs, but it's basically the opposite of 12-step. It's all about teaching you over and over that you are in control and you can overcome urges, you can choose to quit the addiction etc. You are not an addict for life. ( But that doesn't mean doing addictive behaviors in moderation, they STRONGLY recommend 100% abstinence from former addictions- Which I, science and everyone else 100% agree on. They just mean you don't have to define yourself as an addict, as for many that can be counter productive. Introducing oneself like "Hi, I am quitforever then win and I am a Sex Addict" as they require or VERY STRONGLY encourage over and over really really was NOT good for me.)  I have the SMart booklet and like to read through it from time to time. That and the "your brain on porn" book by Gary Wilson are gold in my opinion. You can also help people on this forum, find people in smart. etc.

Cool that you mentioned wanting to build muscle/exercise first. Because I think that's probably the best thing to start with. Cardio is the best, but lifting/ building muscle can change your body chemistry and change how you look, which really really can help with self image. Being strong feels really good, you can just feel it and it ups your confidence. To get started do what ever you feel comfortable with. One good thing from 12 step is the phrase "Progress over perfection". Maybe start with machines, or even exercise classes at your gym, to build up your strength and confidence.

Good reminder, as I think I could really use some more strength training in my life soon, so will prob add some machine workouts to my routine.

Edit: Almost missed that you asked about therapy too. My experience with therapy, is I had to try many therapists most were awful but when I found a good one it was helpful. I found things most helpful actually when I did not really talk about my addiction with the therapist. Just going there for like good advice and support. Really had to find the right person. For me, most therapists recommend either 12 step or "why don't you just watch a little porn" as really most people don't understand addiction. But again, for the support and working on other life areas (go in with an idea of what you want) it can be helpful and when I found the right person it did make it a bit easier to get a streak going. But it's not 100% necessary imo.

STAY AWAY (in my opinion) from sex therapists or people who list that they treat sex/porn addiction. As they are almost all totally uneducated about porn and the real bad effects of it ( I STRONGLY recommend "your brain on pron" by gary wilson for more about this and to really understand whats going on in your brain) . The sex/ porn/ sex addiction therapists almost exclusively have NO IDEA what they are talking about. They are usually taught "sex positivity" and do not distinguish porn from sex, they are unaware of changing sexual tastes induced by porn. They will say the addiction is a result of you not accepting your sexuality or something and try and convince you to accept you porn induced fetishes and stuff. There is zero evidence that that has anything to do with porn/ sex addiction and compulsion in just about anyone. Literally what they are taught is based on people sitting around thinking theoretically and thinking "oh, that sounds interesting" and teaching it to them in college, when it comes to sex therapists/ experts.

This happened to me, called up a "Sex addiction therapist" and they were a wackjob who said "just accept your sexuality and it won't be compulsive". That is a HUGE rationalization that my brain  loved to use to try and get me to relapse. ( I gained some very disturbing fetishes from my porn addiction that absolutely did not turn me on in the past, that thankfully start to disappear as I get further and further away from porn).

Cliffs: The best resources I have found are * This forum * The smart recovery book and * "your brain on porn" by gary wilson as well as the your brain on porn website.
« Last Edit: November 13, 2019, 05:10:40 PM by quitforeverthenwin2 »

gragnok

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Re: gragnoks journal
« Reply #5 on: November 13, 2019, 05:51:35 PM »
Wow! You have tons of experience!! Thanks for all the information.
And I’ll think twice about the 12 step group for sure.
Honestly I’m in such a high right now gonna just wait and see about therapy also.
And will def be reading your brain on porn to start.

quitforeverthenwin2

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Re: gragnoks journal
« Reply #6 on: November 13, 2019, 11:56:40 PM »
Thanks man! Haha good that my experience (mostly mistakes) can help others avoid some of the same pitfalls. Sounds good! Keep going strong! Feeling really good is good, but don't get too excited to the point that you don't do all the little things that keep your success coming! ( I've been there).

Keep it up and keep sticking around the forum, posting here in a journal most days is incredibly effective...

gragnok

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Re: gragnoks journal
« Reply #7 on: November 15, 2019, 11:32:12 AM »
Day 3!
Still going strong! just been super busy.
And def know about the maintaining the little things for success.
Not that I’m perfect, just been through the cycle of thinking I’m good and letting the little things go, and know how fast that can turn into a downward spiral.
Anyways have my first free time in a little while. Don’t work until  tonight. Gonna do some workouts and meditate this morning.  Also playing the new Pokémon game.

quitforeverthenwin2

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Re: gragnoks journal
« Reply #8 on: November 15, 2019, 09:48:01 PM »
Sick stuff dude! Yup, I think everyone one of us has been in that cycle of letting the little stuff slide, this forum helps a TON with preventing that. Have fun with the game and keep it up!

gragnok

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Re: gragnoks journal
« Reply #9 on: November 17, 2019, 10:17:16 PM »
Day 5.
Still going strong. Not much to report, but feel the need to check in for some reason.

quitforeverthenwin2

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Re: gragnoks journal
« Reply #10 on: November 18, 2019, 09:32:27 AM »
Great, that's a good habit imo. The quick little check ins can help, even if they make us just 5% more aware or motivated (it's probably even more than that though)

gragnok

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Re: gragnoks journal
« Reply #11 on: November 18, 2019, 03:46:18 PM »
Feelings tons of doubt right now.
Is this a cult?
Thoughts are like I don’t actually have a problem.
No PIED, or other obvious problems from pmo. I have a girlfriend and a healthy sexual relationship, so just feeling like it doesn’t matter if I look at porn.
I will feel guilty and awful if I pmo I know that much. But sometimes I wonder if the guilt itself is what I need to be addressing and not the occasional pmo.

quitforeverthenwin2

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Re: gragnoks journal
« Reply #12 on: November 18, 2019, 04:13:17 PM »
Well, that's awesome that your problems with porn side effects aren't that severe. I think it'd be pretty tough for a forum to be a cult lol. Cults have to do quite a bit to brainwash people, all sorts of techniques etc. 12 Step is a bit of a cult, but again if it works for people to not die of ODs and stuff good for them and it's very unlike money making cults. Besides SOMETHING brought you here right?

Well, I can tell you that I have thought almost the same stuff you are thinking right now. But now that I am not in that mental state I know FOR SURE porn was a massive massive problem for me. Maybe there are some people who watch a little porn and it's no big deal, but I still think they'd be better off not watching porn.

I spent months thinking maybe guilt is the problem, I watched porn again, things got out of hand to say the least. I was miserable doing some crazy stuff.

Again maybe that isn't you.

But, I can just say that I had similar thoughts and they led me to a really bad place. I still get them sometimes. The addictive part of our brain trys to rationalize why this stuff is okay.

Porn isn't natural you know? It's not like we're trying to give up breathing or eating. If porn is no problem for you, then you should be able to just stop doing it easily lol

Maybe you can share in more detail what brought you to this forum? There are like 100 active members here or less. There are 100 million young men AT LEAST who watch porn, so something must have brought you here.....


gragnok

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Re: gragnoks journal
« Reply #13 on: November 18, 2019, 05:28:42 PM »
Day 0. Zero.
I know this isn’t a cult. I just was using the form to try to convince myself but for some reason it backfired. I was rationalizing since I don’t have physical side effects.
But now I get to experience the emotional side effects all over again.
Feeling depressed. Now I’m really don’t wanna workout which I def would have otherwise.
Idk. Not giving up, day zero as I said.

quitforeverthenwin2

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Re: gragnoks journal
« Reply #14 on: November 18, 2019, 10:35:24 PM »
It's okay. Relapsing always stinks, but you are still here posting and had a little streak going. If you get right back on the horse right away, as you seem to be doing the effects won't be too strong.

It's actually awesome that you posted that, about "is this a cult" etc. Because you got to play that entire thought process out, see it led to relapse and that relapse feels super shitty. So now you know, it's just a trick the addictive mind uses to rationalize a relapse. You have it literally written down now the thought, the result and the bad feelings. So it'll be a lot tougher for those thoughts to get you next time.

Again, awesome you posted right after relapsing, if you do that and you keep staying on it, you'll get it done. I have made the mistake of relapsing and staying off the forum for months and going back to like square one, now that really sucks...

So keep it up man! Tomorrow is a new day! Use this as motivation to stay clean in the future.

gragnok

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Re: gragnoks journal
« Reply #15 on: November 18, 2019, 11:47:29 PM »
Thanks for responding right away, I appreciate it.
And ya I didn’t want to post right away but I also knew I didn’t want to crawl down a hole either.
I do feel like I got confirmation that I really don’t want to be looking at porn ever, and that it definitely makes my life worse and me worse off. Ready to double down on my enthusiasm for being porn free because obviously I need to, and I’m genuinely excited.
Of course I’m super motivated to workout and eat well and everything too, but I just want to make it clear to myself that staying porn free is the number one priority, the rest usually falls into place somewhat if I can get a good streak going. And I’ll try to open up more on here, it’s kinda hard for me but I see that that could be helpful for both myself and others.

gragnok

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Re: gragnoks journal
« Reply #16 on: November 19, 2019, 02:03:22 PM »
Okay day one.
Got up early and skated even though I was feeling a little sluggish. So glad about that.
Trying to figure out how to really mean it this time, like I feel so much conviction right now, but it is hard to hold on to. I actually think I like the one day at a time thing for quitting porn. Like on any given day it’s definitely just a choice to ruin that day (at least) to pmo.
Anyways my pride is a little hurt but that’s fine. I guess this is a process. I know not to expect it to be easy now. Which is also fine, I can do pain for transformation.
Also porn was always a very much secret thing for me. And I don’t like that, I feel like I’m a little secretive about posting here, ie I don’t want my girlfriend to know really, but I want to at least be okay at least with  the possibility. Anyways I think the secrecy is part of the shame and I think it has some big picture implications to feel like you have to hide some aspect of yourself. I want to have nothing to hide!
« Last Edit: November 19, 2019, 02:34:44 PM by gragnok »

quitforeverthenwin2

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Re: gragnoks journal
« Reply #17 on: November 19, 2019, 11:23:13 PM »
Hey man whatever works best! Not a soul in my life knows I post on this forum... and I am fine with that and this forum is still great for me. So do whatever you think is best.

Also man, same with the forum. You are not obligated to share anything about yourself. Some people are more open about their lives, others are less open. Just use the forum in whatever way helps you the most.

As far as keeping the motivation and conviction a few things help:
1) Writing down what motivates you, you can do this for a minute or two a few times a week or daily if you like. ( I also strongly reccomend the smart recovery book, they have a lot of good tools and info on this)
2) Reading about the science behind pmo. Like the your brain on porn website or book.
3) Check out other journals and encourage other guys and encourage them to quit. In this way it is a little like a cult lol. In cults they have people convert other people to the cult to increase their belief and motivation. Encouraging other guys to quit helps them of course and will increase your own resolve and motivation to quit. WIN-WIN

gragnok

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Re: gragnoks journal
« Reply #18 on: November 20, 2019, 01:59:39 PM »
day 2
starting off strong today. got up early and skated again, a huge perk of not looking at porn. just feel like i pop out of bed some much easier and have so much more motivation.
last night at work was pretty hard for some reason, not because i wanted to look at porn or anything just like feeling down. think its just hangover type feelings from relapsing. also i know this isn't all literally a direct result of pmo or anything but def its a pattern and a cycle. anyways today is good so far. meditated also which i think is very good for me. and exercised (skating). seems like good things to do everyday if possible.
any other daily habits anyone would recommend? think i might be obsessed with self improvement haha. that's fine with me.

quitforeverthenwin2

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Re: gragnoks journal
« Reply #19 on: Today at 12:17:19 AM »
Congrats on another day in the bank and getting right back on the horse!

gragnok

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Re: gragnoks journal
« Reply #20 on: Today at 09:05:21 AM »
Day 3.
Up early and just had a massive urge but managed to get though it.
Crazy how much doubt creeps in, but read some of the form and looked back over my journal and think I’m through.