Author Topic: Feeling numb to gf or wife in general?  (Read 745 times)

ruuddejong

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Feeling numb to gf or wife in general?
« on: November 04, 2018, 08:19:32 AM »
I am curious, do you guys also have this or did the successful ones observe it go away:

- I am married to a 10/10, but sexually or in life in general, I feel nothing sexual at all towards her, while I want to fuck every other girl who is even 5/10. And with wife, it is a real struggle to get hard, and once i am hard and we have sex, i have to try really hard to come. With a stranger, it is instant and I come in about 30 seconds, I believe this is because I am using strangers as a porn sub.

Also in general, I am quite uninterested towards my wife. I love her and I would never want to lose her, but also often I'd prefer to be alone (and watch porn!).

So I am trying to understand and hoping that the reason is porn, nothing else.

 

DoneAtLast

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Re: Feeling numb to gf or wife in general?
« Reply #1 on: November 04, 2018, 03:43:03 PM »
Yeah, the reason is porn.

The issue with your wife/other women isn't that they aren't beautiful, it is that they are static.  What I mean is that as beautiful as your wife is to you, she isn't changing constantly.  Porn changes as fast as you want it, and if you're like most porn users, you have multiple tabs open at once.  So, not only are you getting constantly changing women, you're getting several all at once!  We have novelty seeking built in to us in a small way, but with porn it becomes overblown and uncontrollable.  It is tempting to say that "that's just how we're wired, we're just guys", but the fact is that we're hot wired and have the voltage jacked up way past where it should be, even if we have novelty seeking built into our circuits to begin with.  One major effect of rebooting is getting control over that again.  I would all but guarantee that quitting porn will help that in the long term.  I stop short of a full promise because from the sounds of your post you may or may not also have sex addiction issues to deal with.  The sex with strangers piece is what is suggesting that to me.  If you feel that's the case, counseling may also be a good step.

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Re: Feeling numb to gf or wife in general?
« Reply #2 on: November 04, 2018, 06:08:09 PM »
you are basically cheating in a relationship and that is natural from a biological standpoint. if you are Oing with your wife constantly, your brain thinks you are reproducing. O=reproduction. after a while, it does not make a sense to your brain why would you keep reproducing with the same partner. the goal is to spread your genes as wide and far as possible. to make sure you spread as wide and far as possible, your brain starts to turn off attraction for your current partner and increases attraction of all others. thats why even loyal guys sometimes have tough time with being loyal and if not physically doing it, they at least mentally are thinking about cheating from time to time. thats why the current state of all those long term relationship seems to be so far away from the first few months when they had butterflies. its so hard to find long term couple that is still deep in love with each other.

thats also why porn addiction is sooo tough. your brain thinks you are reproducing with all those women on screen. imagine that. its the most natural instinct. reproduction may be even above survival instinct i think. why survive if you dont reproduce, its death of the species. but if you reproduce, survival of the species is like a higher goal, above individual survival. reproduction is more important.

quit porn either way. you dont seem to have porn related sexual problems if with other partners you have no problems, but quitting porn with help you in every way no matter what it is that you are dealing with. its really important that you quit porn, your happiness is deeply dependent on it.
My last relapse: 14. Aug. 2019

jimthejones

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Re: Feeling numb to gf or wife in general?
« Reply #3 on: November 04, 2018, 09:23:16 PM »
I agree with the gents , there could be other factors but quitting porn will definitely help you improve. what your describing sounds like  the Coolidge effect.

ruuddejong

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Re: Feeling numb to gf or wife in general?
« Reply #4 on: November 05, 2018, 12:59:49 AM »
Thanks guys, both of you make lots of sense. I think I do not have sex addiction, but my porn addiction causes me to want to have sex with all these other people, because whenever I am with a stranger and as soon as I O (with or without sex), I don't wanna do anything with that person and I want to leave (or that person to leave) asap. Because I think the goal for my brain is to O using a new person, much like those many tabs we have open during P.

Also, I do have sexual problems with porn, as I have issues keeping erection with wife or getting aroused with wife. I started a thread where I described it a bit more in detail and started day count of no PMO (or sex with strangers).

malando

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Re: Feeling numb to gf or wife in general?
« Reply #5 on: November 06, 2018, 11:11:38 AM »
you are basically cheating in a relationship and that is natural from a biological standpoint. if you are Oing with your wife constantly, your brain thinks you are reproducing. O=reproduction. after a while, it does not make a sense to your brain why would you keep reproducing with the same partner. the goal is to spread your genes as wide and far as possible. to make sure you spread as wide and far as possible, your brain starts to turn off attraction for your current partner and increases attraction of all others. thats why even loyal guys sometimes have tough time with being loyal and if not physically doing it, they at least mentally are thinking about cheating from time to time. thats why the current state of all those long term relationship seems to be so far away from the first few months when they had butterflies. its so hard to find long term couple that is still deep in love with each other.

thats also why porn addiction is sooo tough. your brain thinks you are reproducing with all those women on screen. imagine that. its the most natural instinct. reproduction may be even above survival instinct i think. why survive if you dont reproduce, its death of the species. but if you reproduce, survival of the species is like a higher goal, above individual survival. reproduction is more important.

quit porn either way. you dont seem to have porn related sexual problems if with other partners you have no problems, but quitting porn with help you in every way no matter what it is that you are dealing with. its really important that you quit porn, your happiness is deeply dependent on it.

I've heard this evolutionary/reproductive argument more times than I can count. It wraps up things in a neat little bow and explains our sexual urges and responses.  Sure, we can all attest to the excitement of something/somebody new, but I also think it's total baloney that you have to get tired and less responsive to your partner just because you've been with them for many years. This idea that the brain is governed by a subconscious awareness of the reproductive history you share with your partner sounds fancy, but it's completely unproven. It's a trite reduction of Darwinistic principles, which themselves are subject to questioning. ie. theory vs proof.

I have been with my partner for 7 years now. By the theory you have propounded above, my subconscious should have well and truly got the message that I have reproduced successfully with her. Not only that, but we actually have a 4 year old daughter. So if there is any truth to this theory that I will experience a down-regulation of response to my partner and an increase to unknown (attractive to me) women, it really should be happening by now. I can tell you that this has not been the case whatsoever. I am as excited by my partner as ever. Her body drives me wild. I even find the fact that she has born my child to be arousing. The longer we have been together, the less attracted I have become to other women. I notice them, but I don't feel a primal need to mate with them. There is no reproductive imperative for me to shift my focus from my partner onto multiple strangers so I can spread my genetic material.

Human relationships are a good deal more complex than any theory as basic as the one you put forward can explain. Yes, there is a primitive component to our brain, but there are so many more higher brain functions which contradict the primal brain's messaging. We are the sum total of our brain's functioning - not just the vestigial part which was inherited from our primitive ancestors. I think you could just as easily advance a theory that the modern obsession with porn and sex via hookup sites etc is a learned cultural phenomenon and driven by extreme dopamine responses: that is, super stimulus which was not previously available to us suddenly is. And a lot of people want their share of this revelry. It doesn't mean their primitive brain is driving that behaviour due to reproductive imperatives. Dopamine addiction and association with sexual super stimuli can accomplish that all on its own. Sex is very pleasurable, and the brain can simply be focussed on the attainment of that enjoyment.

DoneAtLast

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Re: Feeling numb to gf or wife in general?
« Reply #6 on: November 06, 2018, 01:46:53 PM »
you are basically cheating in a relationship and that is natural from a biological standpoint. if you are Oing with your wife constantly, your brain thinks you are reproducing. O=reproduction. after a while, it does not make a sense to your brain why would you keep reproducing with the same partner. the goal is to spread your genes as wide and far as possible. to make sure you spread as wide and far as possible, your brain starts to turn off attraction for your current partner and increases attraction of all others. thats why even loyal guys sometimes have tough time with being loyal and if not physically doing it, they at least mentally are thinking about cheating from time to time. thats why the current state of all those long term relationship seems to be so far away from the first few months when they had butterflies. its so hard to find long term couple that is still deep in love with each other.

thats also why porn addiction is sooo tough. your brain thinks you are reproducing with all those women on screen. imagine that. its the most natural instinct. reproduction may be even above survival instinct i think. why survive if you dont reproduce, its death of the species. but if you reproduce, survival of the species is like a higher goal, above individual survival. reproduction is more important.

quit porn either way. you dont seem to have porn related sexual problems if with other partners you have no problems, but quitting porn with help you in every way no matter what it is that you are dealing with. its really important that you quit porn, your happiness is deeply dependent on it.

I've heard this evolutionary/reproductive argument more times than I can count. It wraps up things in a neat little bow and explains our sexual urges and responses.  Sure, we can all attest to the excitement of something/somebody new, but I also think it's total baloney that you have to get tired and less responsive to your partner just because you've been with them for many years. This idea that the brain is governed by a subconscious awareness of the reproductive history you share with your partner sounds fancy, but it's completely unproven. It's a trite reduction of Darwinistic principles, which themselves are subject to questioning. ie. theory vs proof.

I have been with my partner for 7 years now. By the theory you have propounded above, my subconscious should have well and truly got the message that I have reproduced successfully with her. Not only that, but we actually have a 4 year old daughter. So if there is any truth to this theory that I will experience a down-regulation of response to my partner and an increase to unknown (attractive to me) women, it really should be happening by now. I can tell you that this has not been the case whatsoever. I am as excited by my partner as ever. Her body drives me wild. I even find the fact that she has born my child to be arousing. The longer we have been together, the less attracted I have become to other women. I notice them, but I don't feel a primal need to mate with them. There is no reproductive imperative for me to shift my focus from my partner onto multiple strangers so I can spread my genetic material.

Human relationships are a good deal more complex than any theory as basic as the one you put forward can explain. Yes, there is a primitive component to our brain, but there are so many more higher brain functions which contradict the primal brain's messaging. We are the sum total of our brain's functioning - not just the vestigial part which was inherited from our primitive ancestors. I think you could just as easily advance a theory that the modern obsession with porn and sex via hookup sites etc is a learned cultural phenomenon and driven by extreme dopamine responses: that is, super stimulus which was not previously available to us suddenly is. And a lot of people want their share of this revelry. It doesn't mean their primitive brain is driving that behaviour due to reproductive imperatives. Dopamine addiction and association with sexual super stimuli can accomplish that all on its own. Sex is very pleasurable, and the brain can simply be focussed on the attainment of that enjoyment.

Well said.

ruuddejong

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Re: Feeling numb to gf or wife in general?
« Reply #7 on: November 07, 2018, 02:37:39 AM »
you are basically cheating in a relationship and that is natural from a biological standpoint. if you are Oing with your wife constantly, your brain thinks you are reproducing. O=reproduction. after a while, it does not make a sense to your brain why would you keep reproducing with the same partner. the goal is to spread your genes as wide and far as possible. to make sure you spread as wide and far as possible, your brain starts to turn off attraction for your current partner and increases attraction of all others. thats why even loyal guys sometimes have tough time with being loyal and if not physically doing it, they at least mentally are thinking about cheating from time to time. thats why the current state of all those long term relationship seems to be so far away from the first few months when they had butterflies. its so hard to find long term couple that is still deep in love with each other.

thats also why porn addiction is sooo tough. your brain thinks you are reproducing with all those women on screen. imagine that. its the most natural instinct. reproduction may be even above survival instinct i think. why survive if you dont reproduce, its death of the species. but if you reproduce, survival of the species is like a higher goal, above individual survival. reproduction is more important.

quit porn either way. you dont seem to have porn related sexual problems if with other partners you have no problems, but quitting porn with help you in every way no matter what it is that you are dealing with. its really important that you quit porn, your happiness is deeply dependent on it.

I've heard this evolutionary/reproductive argument more times than I can count. It wraps up things in a neat little bow and explains our sexual urges and responses.  Sure, we can all attest to the excitement of something/somebody new, but I also think it's total baloney that you have to get tired and less responsive to your partner just because you've been with them for many years. This idea that the brain is governed by a subconscious awareness of the reproductive history you share with your partner sounds fancy, but it's completely unproven. It's a trite reduction of Darwinistic principles, which themselves are subject to questioning. ie. theory vs proof.

I have been with my partner for 7 years now. By the theory you have propounded above, my subconscious should have well and truly got the message that I have reproduced successfully with her. Not only that, but we actually have a 4 year old daughter. So if there is any truth to this theory that I will experience a down-regulation of response to my partner and an increase to unknown (attractive to me) women, it really should be happening by now. I can tell you that this has not been the case whatsoever. I am as excited by my partner as ever. Her body drives me wild. I even find the fact that she has born my child to be arousing. The longer we have been together, the less attracted I have become to other women. I notice them, but I don't feel a primal need to mate with them. There is no reproductive imperative for me to shift my focus from my partner onto multiple strangers so I can spread my genetic material.

Human relationships are a good deal more complex than any theory as basic as the one you put forward can explain. Yes, there is a primitive component to our brain, but there are so many more higher brain functions which contradict the primal brain's messaging. We are the sum total of our brain's functioning - not just the vestigial part which was inherited from our primitive ancestors. I think you could just as easily advance a theory that the modern obsession with porn and sex via hookup sites etc is a learned cultural phenomenon and driven by extreme dopamine responses: that is, super stimulus which was not previously available to us suddenly is. And a lot of people want their share of this revelry. It doesn't mean their primitive brain is driving that behaviour due to reproductive imperatives. Dopamine addiction and association with sexual super stimuli can accomplish that all on its own. Sex is very pleasurable, and the brain can simply be focussed on the attainment of that enjoyment.

Thanks for your interesting thoughts. This made me wonder when you had the addiction, when you managed to stop etc, because sounds like you have the ideal relationship that we all want AND since you are in this forum, you had the addiction at some point in your life. Is there a link we can read about your story?

malando

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Re: Feeling numb to gf or wife in general?
« Reply #8 on: November 07, 2018, 09:37:16 AM »

Thanks for your interesting thoughts. This made me wonder when you had the addiction, when you managed to stop etc, because sounds like you have the ideal relationship that we all want AND since you are in this forum, you had the addiction at some point in your life. Is there a link we can read about your story?

Hi ruuddejong, when I met my partner I had already had a P addiction for almost 20 years. Of course I wasn't aware of this for most of that time. I never really got proper PIED, and when I got together with my partner, I was fully functional and felt very excited by our sex life. The thing is, I had always considered the having a high sex drive was fine, and that if I indulged in PMO in addition to the great sex I was having, it wasn't really hurting anyone unless I couldn't perform with my partner. At some stage though, I started to feel like P was an intrusive force - like it had infiltrated my thinking and that it was present even when I was having sex with my partner. I was using porn fantasies to get more aroused, and it was a habit. I was wanting to act out P like scenes with my partner. She wasn't against it - she had no problem with anything we did. She wasn't anti-porn, and she watched it sometimes herself. It was basically just a growing awareness that started in me that P was too present in my life and my thinking. I started to question whether I have a problem. I found sites like YBOP and this one and concluded that yes, I definitely have a problem with P. I started to crave an intimacy with my partner that was just me and her, not all this other cynical crap that P represents. So I started to try to give it up. It was initially easy to stop, my first stint was about 7-8 weeks and it wasn't even hard to stop. Our sex life went to another level after I stopped. At some point I relapsed again during a dry spell with my partner. It happened a couple more times before I stopped permanently. I think porn just got me on a novelty quest to see everything in the world - but eventually I realised this was a ridiculous quest. I didn't really need it. I looked at it because it was there and because it produced some excitement. But I actually feel a lot more excitement now. Sex with my partner now is brilliant - a lot better than hours of porn. Giving up P means bringing sex back into proper proportion. It shouldn't occupy most of your thinking and take hours out of your day. It should be something that is enjoyable with a consenting partner, but is in balance with other things that make us healthy individuals.

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Re: Feeling numb to gf or wife in general?
« Reply #9 on: November 08, 2018, 01:18:56 AM »

Thanks for your interesting thoughts. This made me wonder when you had the addiction, when you managed to stop etc, because sounds like you have the ideal relationship that we all want AND since you are in this forum, you had the addiction at some point in your life. Is there a link we can read about your story?

Hi ruuddejong, when I met my partner I had already had a P addiction for almost 20 years. Of course I wasn't aware of this for most of that time. I never really got proper PIED, and when I got together with my partner, I was fully functional and felt very excited by our sex life. The thing is, I had always considered the having a high sex drive was fine, and that if I indulged in PMO in addition to the great sex I was having, it wasn't really hurting anyone unless I couldn't perform with my partner. At some stage though, I started to feel like P was an intrusive force - like it had infiltrated my thinking and that it was present even when I was having sex with my partner. I was using porn fantasies to get more aroused, and it was a habit. I was wanting to act out P like scenes with my partner. She wasn't against it - she had no problem with anything we did. She wasn't anti-porn, and she watched it sometimes herself. It was basically just a growing awareness that started in me that P was too present in my life and my thinking. I started to question whether I have a problem. I found sites like YBOP and this one and concluded that yes, I definitely have a problem with P. I started to crave an intimacy with my partner that was just me and her, not all this other cynical crap that P represents. So I started to try to give it up. It was initially easy to stop, my first stint was about 7-8 weeks and it wasn't even hard to stop. Our sex life went to another level after I stopped. At some point I relapsed again during a dry spell with my partner. It happened a couple more times before I stopped permanently. I think porn just got me on a novelty quest to see everything in the world - but eventually I realised this was a ridiculous quest. I didn't really need it. I looked at it because it was there and because it produced some excitement. But I actually feel a lot more excitement now. Sex with my partner now is brilliant - a lot better than hours of porn. Giving up P means bringing sex back into proper proportion. It shouldn't occupy most of your thinking and take hours out of your day. It should be something that is enjoyable with a consenting partner, but is in balance with other things that make us healthy individuals.

That is excellent and this is exactly where I want to end up as well. Although as a starting point, I have a little more problems than you did.

Last night wife finally told me that she never feels wanted and even when we have sex, she feels I am not really there and I just do it because we need to do it. She is right. I only do it because I know I have to. I don't even get horny next to her, wanting her etc. I just told her that I think she is very beautiful and sexy (and she is, honestly, a 10/10).

I am hoping this is all because of porn and my senses will come back to life. First years of relationship and marriage, we were doing it 3-4 times a week at least, and sometimes multiple times a day and I wasn't doing porn in that period because it was all new and exciting, so I did not need porn I guess.

The problem now is, unless I truly want her and initiate sex and make her feel it is real (not because I have to), she will not be happy and she can easily see the difference between now and then. And THAT won't happen anytime soon, I am in Day 5 and already feeling like flatline is coming, who knows how long will that last...

ruuddejong

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Re: Feeling numb to gf or wife in general?
« Reply #10 on: December 23, 2018, 07:49:18 AM »
Day 50 and I still have no desire or sexual attraction to my wife. I read lots of Success Stories - only some are related, since most people did want their wives but they just couldn't get it up. In my case, if we somehow end up in bed to have sex, I can get it up one way or other and we can have successful sex. The problem is that, unless she initiates it or I know she will get upset if we don't do for a few more days (because it has been a while), then I do not even care or think about having sex with her. I do want to want her like I used to do, but it is just not happening.

But the few stories I found relevant mentioned that after day X (some 60ish, some 90ish), things started to suddenly turn around and their real libido came to life.

I do hope it is a more sudden turn of events in that front, because I am not seeing any gradual improvements on the desire part. Though the erections ARE getting better.

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Re: Feeling numb to gf or wife in general?
« Reply #11 on: December 27, 2018, 08:48:30 PM »
Hi - My situation is not entirely the same as yours. However I can conclusively state that going 99 days (with one relapse) PMO free has hugely increased my desire for my wife. Hang in there. Focus on the reboot, focus on the non-sexual things that help develop and maintain a bond, and see what happens.

ruuddejong

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Re: Feeling numb to gf or wife in general?
« Reply #12 on: December 30, 2018, 02:48:44 AM »
Hi - My situation is not entirely the same as yours. However I can conclusively state that going 99 days (with one relapse) PMO free has hugely increased my desire for my wife. Hang in there. Focus on the reboot, focus on the non-sexual things that help develop and maintain a bond, and see what happens.

Thanks man, appreciate the feedback and encouragement. One question: did you see gradual improvement in your desire or was it like a sudden increase (like some guys say coming out of flatline with huge libido etc)?

switched_off

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Re: Feeling numb to gf or wife in general?
« Reply #13 on: December 30, 2018, 08:40:27 AM »
Hi - My situation is not entirely the same as yours. However I can conclusively state that going 99 days (with one relapse) PMO free has hugely increased my desire for my wife. Hang in there. Focus on the reboot, focus on the non-sexual things that help develop and maintain a bond, and see what happens.

Thanks man, appreciate the feedback and encouragement. One question: did you see gradual improvement in your desire or was it like a sudden increase (like some guys say coming out of flatline with huge libido etc)?

In the first part of my reboot, I was more focussed on abstaining from previous bad habits and associated mood swings. Once this started to clear I have been left with my libido and my wife. I don't really know if I flatlined at any point. So gradual improvement I guess.