Author Topic: I can give up, I've done it loads of times  (Read 1687 times)

Coffeenut

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Re: I can give up, I've done it loads of times
« Reply #25 on: August 06, 2017, 12:40:05 AM »
Day 13 am thoughts.
Thanks TAN

How do you come to terms with the fact you have smashed something beautiful and perfect and fragile ?

Struggling with that one.

TakeActionNow

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Re: I can give up, I've done it loads of times
« Reply #26 on: August 06, 2017, 05:36:44 AM »
Actually there is nothing in this world that is beautiful perfect and fragile. Everything we know of is in a continual state of flux.
But by setting these high standards to people or  things you are setting yourself up for failure because you are focusing on ideals not reality.

Instead, see it that you have caused hurt to someone.
In this case, what should you do?

Establish to them that you acknowledge your responsibilities
Work hard to improve the situation
« Last Edit: August 06, 2017, 10:36:41 AM by TakeActionNow »
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js2004

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Re: I can give up, I've done it loads of times
« Reply #27 on: August 06, 2017, 12:39:35 PM »
Well, I think you do one of two things, you either attempt to fix it or you move on. I can only speak to my case, so you will have to decide where you are at and which one to land on. For myself, I knew I had an issue about two years before I spoke to my wife about it. I researched everything I could and thought I had it managed but alas I didn't. When I finally came clean about it all I thought for certain my marraige was over and was mentally ready to leave that night. Thankfully my wife wasn't ready to throw me to the curb even after all I had done. I told myself I was getting help and going to clean myself up emotionally (because that is what this is all really about). That was back in Oct 2016. Almost two years after I realized I had a problem. While I have had some setbacks I am a firm believer that sometimes we need to take a step back to go two steps forward. Not a day goes by that I don't thank god my wife is still with me.

The point is you have to be committed to fixing the emotional issue that lead you to P&M. For me there was two issues and as I deal with it I find myself getting better and I feel like my marraige is better too.
We can accomplish anything we put our minds to.

Coffeenut

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Re: I can give up, I've done it loads of times
« Reply #28 on: August 06, 2017, 05:55:44 PM »
Well those are very helpful.

You are so right about the fact this is about more than the p&m.

With me I believe the p&m is a response to something that wasn't right emotionally.
An inability to express emotions properly maybe. I think an inability to engage fully with my partner.
There could be reasons for this, maybe to do with the way people around me dealt with emotions when I was growing up. I had a happy childhood though, I def can't blame that. Its more a lack of emotional vocabulary.

My wife was sad after something I said. I had called her beautiful. She said I had never said that before !!!???
What an idiot.

Day 13 comes to an end. 2nd day away from home with no p, no m.
« Last Edit: August 06, 2017, 05:59:00 PM by Coffeenut »

js2004

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Re: I can give up, I've done it loads of times
« Reply #29 on: August 08, 2017, 10:21:27 AM »
I'm not sure what to tell you there CN.  Just keep working the P&M free lifestyle and things may just work out in the end. But if they don't than at least you are P&M free.
We can accomplish anything we put our minds to.

Coffeenut

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Re: I can give up, I've done it loads of times
« Reply #30 on: August 08, 2017, 05:14:58 PM »
Day 15. Missed out 14. Some days no way I can journal.

Thought for the day. Wouldn't it be good if you had one of those reset buttons which you need a paperclip to get to. Just reset your brain.
Wife stayed with me away last night unusually. Wanted her so much. No chance of that just now, maybe never.
Took up some old pastimes to help me de-stress, also listening to a lot of music searching the words for some inspiration. Think its working.

Still clean, and loving it.

Also, started reading the chimp paradox. This book could save my life.
« Last Edit: August 08, 2017, 05:41:33 PM by Coffeenut »

TakeActionNow

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Re: I can give up, I've done it loads of times
« Reply #31 on: August 08, 2017, 05:56:34 PM »
Coffee,

when we walk away from PMO, we walk into a new life yet unknown.

Do not be afraid of this new life.
Even though it feels unfamiliar, know that it is real.
This new life is our second chance. A chance at redemption.
When in the past, our focus has been on ourselves because of PMO, in this new life, our focus should be on our loved ones.
Where we have been giving our love to false idols without reservation, today, give all your love to those new and dear without reservation.

In the meanwhile, reconnect with yourself. The true you.
Accept and embrace your emotions.
You may be feeling sadness, depression and grief.
It is actually you coming to terms of the death of the previous you, the you that lived a life of the walking dead, now finally laid to rest.
It is the grief, and joy, that we have finally realized, finally accepting, finally coming to terms of something you and I have know for a long time.
It is time to lay that life to rest. And start anew.

Now is the time to move forward with purpose and mission towards your new goal: to live a good clean life of a honest man in touch with himself and reality.
« Last Edit: August 08, 2017, 06:01:42 PM by TakeActionNow »
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Coffeenut

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Re: I can give up, I've done it loads of times
« Reply #32 on: August 09, 2017, 12:37:29 AM »
Observations re ED day 16.

My wife was and is better at getting me hard than porn.

My problem was usually maintaining my erection not getting it.

I can't remember getting hard by just looking at porn without playing with myself.

My wife could get me hard by just whispering in my ear.

Why the fuck am I here !?


Coffeenut

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Re: I can give up, I've done it loads of times
« Reply #33 on: August 09, 2017, 12:44:51 AM »
Every decision we take now, has some degree of influence from a decision /action taken a while ago.
For example
I want to go to the loo to pee (action)
Why? Cos i feel urgent (feeling)
Why? Cos my bladder is full (consequence)
Why? Cos i drank lots of beer earlier (action)
Why? Cos i was thirsty (feeling)
Why? Cos i was walking down the street and saw someone having a pint and that looked delicious and i wanted one for myself too (trigger/desire)
Why? Cos it was a damn hot day (environment)

You see the sequence of events?
You might think, ya its common sense. Nothing special.
True, but what this example shows is, things happen for a reason. Search deeply for a while and you start discovering triggers, emotions and events that over time eventually lead to a likely outcome.
This is understanding the root cause.

Humans are responsive creatures.
We respond to stimuli over time.
To understand our actions better, we need to be more
- mindful of our actions
- sensitive of our feelings
- aware of our triggers

Give it a try.
Ask 5 whys to why you do something
Reflect your emotional states across the day. Is there a gradual buildup?
Through this, you will get to better understand yourself and the roots of your action is.

OK this is copied from a post by TAN on a journal by papa.

My wife has asked me what triggers the porn viewing and I don't really know. I'm going to try work it out.
« Last Edit: August 09, 2017, 12:48:50 AM by Coffeenut »

js2004

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Re: I can give up, I've done it loads of times
« Reply #34 on: August 09, 2017, 05:00:37 AM »
Glad to hear your wife is still communicating with you.  When you are trying to answer the question be honest with yourself.  I wasn't during my first Reboot, which is part of the reason I failed the first time. 
We can accomplish anything we put our minds to.

Coffeenut

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Re: I can give up, I've done it loads of times
« Reply #35 on: August 09, 2017, 06:24:43 PM »
Day 17.

My wife is still communicating but its very hard. I am feeling like a punch bag. I probably need it. She is very angry.

Am i consoled by the fact she cares enough to be angry?

Not sure.

Observations about intrusive thoughts.
Are they acceptable if about your wife?
Maybe not ideal if you're on a hard reboot.

8 years ago we had a d-day. She did everything she could to help me over it. I did hardly anything.
I thought I could beat it, and anyway it wasn't such a big deal.
Fuck fuck fuck fuck.
Look where we are.

Everything I do from now on will be to benefit my wife and family. Did consider suicide to this end, but that would be the easy way out. No, I am taking responsibility.

js2004

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Re: I can give up, I've done it loads of times
« Reply #36 on: August 09, 2017, 08:17:22 PM »
Yeah I'm sure.  Why would she care, she's your wife?  As for the intrusive thoughts, I can tell you it's hit or miss.  When I really get into fantasy land about my wife it's not good and I then crave P&M. But when we have date night and I am anticipating love then it's usually good.  But you really need to figure that out for yourself. 

Stop beating yourself up over the past.  Vow to make this her last d-day.
We can accomplish anything we put our minds to.

Coffeenut

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Re: I can give up, I've done it loads of times
« Reply #37 on: August 11, 2017, 12:58:53 AM »
Thanks js

I did sort of stop beating myself up but she is very good at dragging up the past. She hovers between kindness and anger. Maybe the kindness is most disconcerting because she has given up on me. She said she wouldn't leave but wasn't interested in us being intimate ever again.

Every night I get back there is another rake over the past.
Its a process I suppose and my pom is a betrayal of her trust after last time when I promised I would sort it.

Classic addict. I compartmentalised the pom and our relationship, believing that they were not connected.

I realise now that I cannot use pom even only occasionally, and I'm talking no more than once every couple of weeks, without it affecting our relationship. I really did believe it wasn't but it was still a betrayal and thus we could not be truly connected in love.

I'm there if she wants me, pom free. I think its day 18 now, I will check.

Actually day 19, shouldn't get it wrong, every day is valuable, I stayed away from home last night too, prob 3rd or 4th time in a room on my own with no pom, or even just m.

I am channeling the strength of her emotion to help me stop but as time moves on I can't let the memory of that fade so journalling and recording the days is key I think.
« Last Edit: August 11, 2017, 01:06:25 AM by Coffeenut »

Gracie

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Re: I can give up, I've done it loads of times
« Reply #38 on: August 11, 2017, 06:48:42 AM »
Have you listened to the podcast at the top of the partner page?  It was very helpful to my husband and others, that is why it is there. Dr. Johnson is ver gentle in her talk.  Kevin Skinner is a therapist for sex and porn addicts.  He does the podcast with her.

 Please know that for we wives, it does run hot and cold.  I love my husband.  I loved him during his recovery. But, I, and our marriage, missed out on a lot of commitment from him.  He never touched another woman physically.  However, he let hundreds of women into our house when he viewed and more importantly into his brain.  We went from sex 3 or 4 times a week to one if I was lucky.  And it was just sex not making love.  We can tell it is different we are devastated.

 We can't understand the choosing of them over us.  You can say it is not us or the way we look, but you are choosing them and turning away from us.  So it sure appears that way.  The secrets and lies make us crazy.  And for me, since my husband is older, I missed out on the love making when he was physically healthy.  I do get angry about that.  And yes he knows.   

Be gentle with yourself and her. And look at her with eyes of love.

Coffeenut

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Re: I can give up, I've done it loads of times
« Reply #39 on: August 12, 2017, 05:51:52 PM »
Thank you Gracie. It is extremely helpful hearing from wives perspective.
I couldn't understand why it made my wife so upset the last few times I tried to give up. Ultimately that's why I failed.

I think I'm finally beginning to understand.

The understanding of the damage it has being doing to me is  showing me the problems it has caused us.

My secret place has led to withdrawal emotionally. I thought it was helping me and protecting her.

She has tried everything to help me engage more.

Day 20 now.  Getting loads of thoughts, even urges. My body and brain are noticing something is different now. Not going to be as easy as I thought.

Have to fill my time constructively tomorrow, a day off.

TakeActionNow

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Re: I can give up, I've done it loads of times
« Reply #40 on: August 12, 2017, 09:38:49 PM »
Coffee,

only facts will liberate us.

1. PMO is our go to place to
a. get away from our troubles and
b. kill time
when we stop PMO 2 things happen:
a. what to do with the spare time? Go find something meaningful to do. Fill that time !
b. what happens when we do not allow ourselves get away? You will have to endure the emotional turmoil.
You will be angry, frustrated, upset etc.
Learn to deal with it.
Pain is gain.
This is growth.
No more running away.
The past is dead. Have the courage to cast a new future.

2.
Women live in the here and now
Women care about effort
woman care about showing strength, courage, action and determination.
women care about truth and presence
women wants you to own and deal with your issues, not run away

Its all about character.

Women are strong, extremely strong.
We have to be strong(er) too.

Be strong and determined my friend.
There is no other way.
Self Worth, Self Respect, Self Love
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Coffeenut

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Re: I can give up, I've done it loads of times
« Reply #41 on: August 13, 2017, 05:25:18 PM »
Day 21

Good peace talks today.

I do need to be more present. No hiding away. I am strong, I need to channel it right.

I am going to spend the time I have left enriching others lives. Especially one in partulicular.

Was hurt by the statement that the only reason I'm doing anything is because "I broke my dick". Not for any other reason.

Not true. Not that it matters.

Good luck everyone else dealing with this. Sometimes you have to take some low blows.
« Last Edit: August 13, 2017, 05:30:44 PM by Coffeenut »

Coffeenut

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Re: I can give up, I've done it loads of times
« Reply #42 on: August 13, 2017, 05:36:04 PM »
Another thought

Seems to be right for me to go for total abstinence. No P, no M and no sex ( even if we are back together properly). I need to go back to normal reactions to normal stimuli, a proper reboot is required. It has to be the quickest option. I have wasted the last 34 years ( think I started at 12), might as well not waste any more precious time.

Coffeenut

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Re: I can give up, I've done it loads of times
« Reply #43 on: August 14, 2017, 05:17:06 PM »
Day 22

Another day with thoughts, stomped on quickly.

The chimp paradox book is helping me.

Stay strong, you have to quit guys, you really do.

Coffeenut

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Re: I can give up, I've done it loads of times
« Reply #44 on: August 16, 2017, 01:34:07 AM »
Day 24

Thought it was day 25. Got to stop that, no good wishing your life away.
Am writing in separate journal which my wife writes in. That is separate from this and I can put more stuff in it. Sorry guys but I can't risk  ID for her sake more than mine.

Am giving my chimp lots of bananas. I think he's suspicious that he's being manipulated. If you are wondering if I have a pet chimp then no, am reading " The Chimp Paradox" by Steve Peters.
Its really helping. Would be interested if anyone else has read or is reading.

TakeActionNow

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Re: I can give up, I've done it loads of times
« Reply #45 on: August 16, 2017, 02:42:50 AM »
Coffee, I have the book and i will read it. Thanks for the recommendation
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Coffeenut

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Re: I can give up, I've done it loads of times
« Reply #46 on: August 17, 2017, 04:20:28 PM »
Would love to know what you think TAN.

I am coming to the realisation that my chimp was running things and had his own key to the cage.
I have changed the lock and he is under some proper management.

Another book anyone who has viewed porn, especially with young girls in, should read "half the sky" by Nicholas D Kristof and Sheryl Wudunn.

Listen I'm not religious and I don't want to preach but this book has some shocking statistics and stories about the abuse and trafficking of young women. Guys you cannot guarantee one of them isn't on one of these films. Even if they aren't the whole porn thing is part of the overall problem. We need to respect our fellow humans.

I for one have been somewhat hiding from this subject, but I know most of you deep down feel the same way. Its hard to give it up but this information WILL help.

I'm at the end of day 25 and they are my 25 greatest treasures. They are my road to health and happiness.

Good luck guys and of course partners.

TakeActionNow

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Re: I can give up, I've done it loads of times
« Reply #47 on: August 17, 2017, 08:15:02 PM »
Coffee , the chimp comes in many different names

I have been taught by others to call it the inner critic

it is our emotion, our ego, our memories, calling out to 'protect' us

but it is not based on facts, reality or sensibility

it is based on past experiences, of voices from others and within long ago, echoing out today in the belief that the same will happen again, however unreasonable it may seem.


On the other hand, our goals are based on facts, logic and awareness

hence to reach our goals, we need to tame the inner critic or to silence it

and continue to persevere until and beyond our intended destination

meditate my friend, and find the stillness within where there is no voice.
« Last Edit: August 17, 2017, 08:16:48 PM by TakeActionNow »
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Coffeenut

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Re: I can give up, I've done it loads of times
« Reply #48 on: August 20, 2017, 02:28:48 AM »
Thanks TAN. You are obvs well up on the inner critic chimp thing. I am quite new to recognising it and dealing with it appropriately.

Day 28 today. Had a couple of days off journaling here. I think that's OK. Am organising my thoughts in a written journal too because much of it inappropriate for online.

My displacement activities are guitar and gaming. I  also using gardening and drawing. I am also using spending time with wife and kids as a soother. The simple act of making a drink or talking about rubbish. Normal stuff.

My boys are hard to manage sometimes esp when they are fighting. When they are full on I usually end it by shouting loudest and more persistently. Its pretty exhausting. Probably normal though. Don't know why I mentioned that, my brain must have thought it was relevant.

TakeActionNow

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Re: I can give up, I've done it loads of times
« Reply #49 on: August 20, 2017, 03:42:53 AM »
Coffee, we all start somewhere.
I'm glad its starting for you.

Try to focus your life on doing only meaningful things that are beneficial to others, and may be self improving as well. Life is short, so dont spend any more time on meaningless stuff like gaming. It has taken too much of my time and i hope it will not take any more of yours.

Allow me to teach you 2 more things:

Loving kindness meditation

Sit in a quiet place, preferably dark, cooling, quiet and comfortable
Sit with back straight, not leaning. This is important for alertness
Before starting, motivate with clear intention what this sitting is for
eg. " i seek calmness in myself and long term vision of happiness with my loved ones"
close eye and focus only on breath
if thoughts enter, say thoughts thoughts thoughts and do not engage with it
if sounds enter, say sounds sounds sounds and do not engage with it
if itch enter, say itch itch itch and do not engage with it
always return to breath.
After calmness has settled, start loving kindness
wish one by one, or in groups, that they are free of pain and suffering, that they are well and happy
Start with yourself and expand outwards until all living beings in the world
Do this about 15 mins a day.

This will develop a calm and loving approach to all people.

Visualization
Spend some time each night visualizing :
- how you manage issues SUCCESSFULLY
- how your family grows abundantly, loving and successfully
- how your capacity to handle matters calmly and successfully grows and grows

This will develop positive motivating confidence and ability when faced with difficult situations.


Long story short,
Your actions and decisions are usually most ideal when you begin with a mind that is clear, compassionate and free of clutter. That comes from daily meditation.


Please give these a try :)
« Last Edit: August 20, 2017, 10:08:57 PM by TakeActionNow »
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